Episode 7 - International Women's Day
Katie Mattise
Hey Everybody and welcome to Flashes of DEI, a Podcast where we explore topics and ideas related to diversity, equity and inclusion. My name is Katie. I use they/them/their pronouns and I serve as a director in the Division of Diversity, Equity and Inclusion.
Dr. Amoaba Gooden
Hi, everyone, welcome to Flashes of DEI. My name is Amoaba Gooden. I use she/her/hers pronouns. And I serve as the vice president of the Division of Diversity, Equity and Inclusion.
Katie Mattise
Yeah, and today we are talking about International Women's Day which takes place each year on March 8th. It's a day where across the world we're asked to honor and celebrate the social, economic, cultural and political achievements of women and in some observances, advocate and rally for more. And even though this episode is definitely dropping after the official celebration, we thought it would still be important to talk about it. So today we're joined by some amazing fellow flashes that I'm super excited to talk to. Would y'all mind introducing yourselves for our listeners?
Dr. Gumiko Monobe
Hi, my name is Dr. Gumiko Monobe. I am an associate professor at teaching, learning, and curriculum studies. I go with she\her\hers. And thank you so much for having me. I'm so excited to be here.
Cassie Pegg-Kirby
My name is Cassie Pegg-Kirby and I'm the director of the Women's Center and I use she/her/hers pronouns and as Gumiko said, really excited to be a part of this conversation and here with all of my fabulous colleagues and friends.
Dr. Charmaine Crawford
Hi, thanks for having me. Charmaine Crawford, associate professor in Africana Studies, and also the director of the Institute of African American affairs and I'm so happy to be on this podcast.
Dr. Amoaba Gooden
Thanks Gumiko, Cassie, Charmaine, for joining us. We're honored that you've agreed to spend some time with us talking about International Women's Day. We've got a lot to talk about. So let's jump right in. So can you share with me what International Women's Day means to you?
Dr. Gumiko Monobe
This day actually reminds me the beginning of my journey to come to this country as well as I think about many women's journeys, personal and also the collective journey of that lives.
Dr. Charmaine Crawford
Here for me, it's just the commitment to the empowerment of girls and women and also the fight for gender equality. So it's two prong in terms of celebrating women's lives the world over and at the same time, recognizing there's still a lot of unfinished business to do in relation to looking of how women are marginalized in mostly all areas of society, and, you know, strategizing around how we could mitigate some of those inequalities. Yeah, yeah.
Cassie Pegg-Kirby
I find it difficult to follow my two colleagues here, but from where I said, it was always interesting to me that this was something International Women's Day that we really don't talk about much in the United States. Yeah. And thinking about the importance of coming together to advocate for one another and the importance of having an awareness of sort of the global impact of gender inequity. I know like the UN Sustainable Development Goals, it's number five. And so some people are recognizing it, but just excited that we find a way to celebrate it here at Kent State and honor all of the diversity that we have represented here and look forward to sort of pushing that out into other spaces so that the recognition and the awareness can be even broader than just here.
Dr. Amoaba Gooden
And Cassie, thanks so much for just making that point about how international Women's Day, IWDS recognized in the US one of the things I was surprised about when I migrated here was just the lack of attention to that day. I mean, in Toronto, where I stepped into my centeredness of my feminism. It was a day of protests of March, but also celebration, and strategizing for action. So I was very surprised to see that kind of lacking in the parts of the West that I lived that Thank you. Absolutely.
Katie Mattise
So I mean, a marvel, you just set up a really nice transition to our next question. Thank you for doing that. Because one of the things about this trip that's really cool and amazing, quite honestly, is that folks have lived in and been to many different places around the world. So would any of you be willing to speak to how you've seen it celebrated or honored?
Dr. Charmaine Crawford
Yeah, I can. I have two vantage points, having grown up in Toronto, Canada, similar to Amoaba. I've seen it come out my activism coming out of graduate work, student organizing, class based movements, LGBTQ and feminist movements. So when International Women's Day the celebration comes it's both a rally, a celebration and also a mandate to initiate discussions with the government and agencies in addressing inequalities that women's face. I was also teaching in the global south in the Caribbean for 12 years in gender and development, and ironically, based on what Cassie saying, I think the West sometimes have an arrogance of a post feminist lens in some ways they've been saved from gender inequality or patriarchy. And ironically in the Global South, our projects or policies have to be gender sensitive. So the work I was doing, certainly through the University of the West Indies and collaborating with UN Women, the government and so forth, and some of the international development agencies from Canada and the US. There was always this basis that it has to have gender equality measures, right, the assumption in some ways, countries in the Global South or particular countries are less in promoting equality between men and women. So there's a discourse around how sustainability and your society can go forward in terms of development. If there is gender inclusiveness, but the same is not propagated in the West even though the indicators around the gender pay gap, violence against women, reproductive rights is under control. And in Barbados, they have one of the most progressive reproductive rights legislations in the English speaking Caribbean and compare this to what's happening to us in terms of a roll back in terms of reproductive rights. It's disconcerting. So I think feminists across the world have to understand their privilege and understand that even if they're in an in a post industrialized country, if you look at the variances in terms of the issues of women's lives, there are similarities, even if the nation itself or the nation state propagates this notion that it's other women in the parts of the so called Global South, that need to be liberated somewhere that it's it's less inclusive, or it's less equal. I'm for me for International Women's Day. It's about all of the world's countries where women are situated and the issues that face them on a daily basis in regards to employment inequality in terms of childcare and affordable childcare, in terms of women's health, and so forth.
Dr. Gumiko Monobe
I just want to share with a little bit about Japan's perspectives do I see the here this country 20 years in although I have been checking all the new see so the I'm not saying I'm the expert only to be able to talk about Japanese gender situation. But gender equity is much much lower. So the reason why I said that Women's International Women's Day is I feel like it's my journey started here. It's partly because that at the time I started to be able to lackey exposed to the for example, feminist theories, to be able to see history or the things that society or the or the organization from a different perspective, different voices or what is hidden something like that. And then that in Japan right now, still, but deliberative, for example, when it's very high, and opportunity for the women of their political voices or the higher level in the institution is very low and then every year there is that how are they in worldwide 138 countries or something like that in usually Japan 810 was something very low, but many people don't recognizing it. So the problem is that it's still hard to voice and then people take it personally, that it may be that you don't have enough effort or something. So they still not being seen as systematic, or they openly be able to talk this the International Women's Day for me it's like all three of you're talking about it is such an important day for me to be remember we are sewer commitment.
Cassie Pegg-Kirby
And I was just going to add you both brought this up and I feel like I need to speak to that. I love that you use the word arrogance, Dr. Crawford because I think about how many conversations I have about the things that we're addressing here and how quickly people here in the United States want to say, Oh, well look what's happening in India or look what's happening in Rwanda or look with wherever it is that they're talking about with this sort. Of You're right. It's an arrogance. And an although I haven't traveled I've been blessed in our space here to be working with a colleague from Nigeria and another colleague from Rwanda, and I have this phenomenal book called the Women's Atlas. And we look at that and we talk about like, the United States, how many women leaders, zero certain countries in Africa 20 plus women leaders over the years like there's just there's a real disconnect and what people think things are and the reality and talking about in the rebuilding Rwanda with gender equity at the center of that process. I mean, I I mean, the United States has a ways to go in so many places. And so I see International Women's Day as an important opportunity to sort of press ourselves to learn about other cultures, and countries and experiences, but also, particularly from where I sit, maybe take a pretty hard look about where we actually sit on some of those markers in the work we could be doing here as well.
Dr. Charmaine Crawford
No, and I agree with you because I think it was the news yesterday, or a couple of days white women make 82 cents to every dollar white men make and black women make probably 72 cents that every white man makes. Right. And from the gender pay gap to black gender pay gap to Cassie you're right political representation. You know we, you know, in the Beijing Platform, the sort of organizers pushed for at least 30% representation in terms of Parliament's of the world you know, in particular countries. US is not even there, right I think it's sort of mid 23 or 24%. So I think that is the gaze, the Western gaze that takes place, and it's dangerous. You know why it's dangerous because women in this country are suffering, right as a result of the fact that we're looking elsewhere instead of looking within to see where the systemic elements are.
Dr. Amoaba Gooden
trying things you know, that actually leads us into kind of the next part of our conversation. The action oriented you mentioned, looking locally, right or even nationally, we tend to look externally in other geographical spaces from the US in terms of addressing inequities and systems of oppression. What do you think? Or how do you think we can actually honor the lives of women through IWD in terms of actions that we can take.
Dr. Charmaine Crawford
for me the key areas is employment in terms of women economic inequality, especially working women, working class women with children, and I think what is going on there's still a reproduction of this meal breader winner ideology that gets festered. Within not only the family but also in the economy. Also reproductive rights and erotic autonomy. Without that, certainly in the private sphere. And women being able to plan pregnancies make decisions about their bodies, and their lives and so forth. That is crucial so that no one other person have the right to infringe on that we need to pay attention to how even across race and class the roll backs on protecting women's right to abortion and, and contraception and anything else. Also impacts on a woman's ability to work to provide to plan around the livelihood of her family and also to challenge the elements around violence and violence has been universal unfortunately, for the women the world over right intimate partners violence, sexual violence and so forth. And I think regardless of the differences that women the world over have, they have mobilized around platforms of ensuring that the state police officers and whomever are responsive to the type of violence that women experience. So those are three essential elements.
Dr. Gumiko Monobe
I agree with all the time made great big areas we need to work with and if I adding something to what champion saying that I'm very interested in the Boise which is hidden for example intersectionalities that the delta genders voices, but when we say gender, there are many layers may socio economic background, family structure, it also the women who are abused, so there are so many layers and then the voices has been covered with different ways not to be learned how to be BD. Be Korbinite thoughts voices in order to make sure that we empower women also in terms of the violence. It's painful. There are many levels of violence, and then it be intergenerational, and then that HVD stop the women to think about the possibilities or how many times women can actually stand up what I tried to say each the two things. One is that how can we think about the systematic areas of when the women experienced the violence, that how to help them I feel like it's still not seen from the Women's perspectives. The reason why I'm saying is that sometimes when we women go to these areas for the support, they we experience, the Bionz How can we be the invest to as a society and then to changing again, going back to the the voices in order to see the big things and also the in education, everyday life? It's important to bring in the voices valuing the voices of the women's but I feel like that it's small steps but at the important things we can remember to do.
Cassie Pegg-Kirby
I'm over here taking notes like these are things I need to go back and check on and learn more about but one of the things that just really struck me and thinking about International Women's Day is that women make up 52% of the world population. So we're actually the majority but how often do things like race, sexuality, you know, do these other identities that many carry divide us in terms of lining up belong, where people are privileged and where people are marginalized and, and I think about the power of coming together. of sort of interrogating that where we sit in privilege and where we said, you know, as as marginalized individuals are to really come to grips with that in a way that we honor those differences and fight together for a quality across the board. If I'm making progress in one area, if I'm not pulling all of these folks, along at the same time are centering those voices that are more marginalized, then it's not really doing the work. And we know there's some recent things in the news that are really pitting women's rights against LGBTQ rights and like how many times are we complicit in our own demise because we fall for those things, and how important it is to really, really dig deep and think about what's really important and recognizing and celebrating those differences and fighting for causes, even if it's not one that lines up with something that is an individual experience
Dr. Amoaba Gooden
collective action. Yeah.
Dr. Charmaine Crawford
yeah answered perfectly, intersectional politics
Dr. Gumiko Monobe
and I'm wondering also the How can we help each other to have the most strategies like we talking about in race aspect, so it's a very systematic, how can we dismantle Cassie talking about the it's not individual, but we need to have the collaborative that voices to make it happen.
Dr. Charmaine Crawford
Being in a smaller nation and island state I was in Barbados. Women's rights advocate who certainly span generations, called for a holistic approach to dealing with violence against women, right, and children. So from the NGOs, from the grassroots to the health sector, to the state, and so forth. And that is how it has to be promoted and also public education. Right to too often at times, we say okay, we have the support systems and people know about it. You need to have that periodic reminder, US signed on to the I think there is a domestic violence law, right? If I'm not mistaken, right. So how many people know about that how many people know how to advocate for women on that? And in terms of the intersectional politics, are we aware of of the the double jeopardy or triple deputy that black women and indigenous women face as a result of violence and they may not be able to get the resources and the help that they need? So I think, in this this sort of this century, we have to learn from the past mistakes, right? So the race class gender division, the race class divisions in terms of this nation in terms of mainstream feminism, marginalizing black women in terms of their activism, and so forth, or even when we get a discussion about looking at the intersectionality of gender and sexuality, we might be pitted against each other in terms of policy resources and the like. Thinking about even in the domestic violence amendments in Barbados, certainly myself and others were pushing to ensure that same sex couples were also protected under that legislation, because they're, they're not and guess what you had the those who are opposed to marriage equality, same sex couples saying that will kill the bill. Some politicians will kill that bill, if that if that section is included. So this is the tough elements of increments and the stages knowing the context. You're in knowing the environment, knowing the state and maybe knowing the area and strategizing along the line in relation that but not to turn a blind eye to it.
Katie Mattise
So with that, and keeping that in mind, right, it takes work, and it takes willingness to have conversations and willingness to tap into other organizations. And, Cassie, you already mentioned a book that, you know, I'm going to check out what sorts of resources or organizations would you suggest people tap into in order to learn more in order to get activated, or any other things that you would kind of tips of advice for those folks who are listening in and want to get into it?
Cassie Pegg-Kirby
I read a lot. I don't remember a lot of what I read for long term but I love to read and learn. And so that book I mentioned the women's Atlas is just a really good visual display of these very, very quick topics. You can look up all different things and it looks at women, women globally and what their experiences are in reality versus what we think because of what we hear. I also would say there's an organization called supermajority, which is great pulling people together and really centering the most marginalized voices of women. They do a lot in terms of activism and creating change and looking at policy and all of those things. There's some bad news about pay equity. AAUW just did a new report where they include they do a more comprehensive report that includes other factors like part time, and they went back and looked during COVID and thought like, wait a second, there's a whole bunch of things we're not thinking about here. And, and so there, they have some recent data about pay equity and what that looks like and how it's impacting different populations of women. When it's women's reproductive rights, places like Planned Parenthood or Guttmacher Institute, those are ones that I refer to regularly for some, some data the US Census has some good do about pay equity. If you really want to dig in and go there, they do it by state, so you can see but it's not a global perspective. And that's where something like these these books, the women's Atlas, and some of the other things do pull in that global perspective. That's just off the top of my head.
Dr. Charmaine Crawford
Yeah, and I am thanks for that. Cassie. It is about strategizing on the national state level. So you have the national organizations now you have the international UN Women, but you also have to know in your city in your state and even in terms of the representative that is representing your area, or wherever you need to know what the discussions are what is on the table. The beauty of using having internet you can google right. And once you hear something, you don't have to go and do the research. There are a lot of resources, right? It's it's where you want to actually put your effort whether locally, nationally or internationally
Dr. Gumiko Monobe
that Cassie and some easy to get so many great organization that local as well as global national, but also that the good one of the first book I read for the feminist book were two women two way of knowing but by Bernanke that so that that it helped me to see how women are separated to so that their voices are separated. So that going to find a place to be find the organization a place to start to be able to talk about it. It's so very important.
Cassie Pegg-Kirby
And I want to give it I want to give a shout out to people in this this area, this conversation that teach some classes too because it knows that she's my new best friend. I'm sure she's I'm not sure how she feels about it. But I saw a syllabus from one of her classes that one of our students was taking and it was powerful and I wanted to like give me the reading list I need to be in on this you know and and in that. That started me thinking like I need to learn more and who is this person and I want to find out more about this. So give me your next on my list. So just so you know, I'm going to be taking all your classes.
Dr. Amoaba Gooden
But I think there's something to be said for that
Cassie Pegg-Kirby
having that eagerness to learn and to know more and how important it is because we have no matter where you are. There are incredible resources around you that you can tap into to learn from even if it's just asking for a book list of you know, a topic that you know someone's well versed on. But I think that's really important to have that sort of quest for knowledge and wanting to make a difference and then figuring out how to do that. I will also say there are places I know our students here on campus are working on it. But there are places where you can learn how to be a change agent in terms of there's an organization called Midwest academy that has a sort of flowchart that says this is how you do this work. Because it's different than we often think it's not just a protest a protest is great for educating, but where's your list of demands and who has the power? Like there are other things that you need to think to be effective to create that change? And so it's helpful to tap your colleagues who's doing that work who's connected with things because it's one thing to have the interest it's another thing to know how to strategically do the work.
Dr. Charmaine Crawford
yeah, and Cassie is so right. You need to want to do you need to have the will and we can't be complacent. And I think what has happened in the 21st century, because women secured the right to vote. We have more access to education that made had in the early 21st century, the 20th century marriage and what I'm saying there's so many things that we secured. There's a degree of complacency for those who didn't have to struggle for those things. But guess what rights and hard fought rights are not etched in stone. They're rollbacks with any social movements we see that policies can be reversed. Leaders could change positions can change. So we need to continue to be proactive in what we're actually actually doing.
Dr. Gumiko Monobe
I agree and when they are either having the boat forgotten, right, I think it's important for us to remember the history how to get there, and it's not so long time ago at all. We're still a long way to go and to learn what we learn and what it really mean.
Dr. Amoaba Gooden
Yeah, thank you so much for the wonderful, wonderful and powerful conversation. Charmaine,Gumiko ,Cassie, we're at the end of our program. I just want to thank you so much for sharing, just your experiences, your wisdom, your knowledge, your time with us. And actually just really, I think educating the community about IWD and all these different spaces. Thank you all. So everyone for tuning in and listening. If you're interested in learning more about DEI, feel free to check out our website at kent.edu/diversity.
Katie Mattise
Yeah, and if you want a part two of this conversation, because I think our participants would definitely be into that. Let us know and email us at diversity@kent.edu or connect with us on social media @DEIKentState across all of our platforms. We'll see you next month with a new episode. And again, thank you to our wonderful guests and the wealth of knowledge that you provided today. Bye everybody.
Transcribed by https://otter.ai